- A 31-year-old female deputy and 24-year-old male deputy were shot while sitting in their patrol car at a Metro rail station in Compton, California. Protesters gathered outside the emergency room at the hospital where they were treated. The sheriff’s department found it necessary to tweet: “To the protesters blocking the entrance & exit of the HOSPITAL EMERGENCY ROOM yelling “We hope they die” referring to 2 LA Sheriff’s ambushed today in #Compton: DO NOT BLOCK EMERGENCY ENTRIES & EXITS TO THE HOSPITAL,. People’s lives are at stake when ambulances can’t get through.” President Trump tweeted in response to the shooting:
Incredible: flat learning curve. After all the uproar about calling people “animals.” And if the shooters are minorities…The only one who can lose this election for President Trump is President Trump.
- The Times of Israel reports, based on a recording of a virtual fundraiser, that Joe Biden said that the recent development of Arab states normalizing relations with Israel was “something positive” President Trump is doing “accidentally.”
Stay classy, Joe. To be fair, that has been the narrative of the Democratic Party/”resistance”/news media alliance for four years: if something goes wrong, it is the President’s fault; if something goes right, it’s either wrong anyway because Trump is responsible, or it’s just luck or an accident.
2. And now, from the world of sports!
- Hawk-Eye Live, a fully electronic line-calling system was used for the first time in The U.S. Open. It eliminates the need for line umpires in tennis, leaving only a chair umpire on court, leaving the machine the final and only word. In the first 225,000 automated calls, 14 errors were detected, and the players liked the system.
Good. This is certain to hasten the advent of computer ball and strike calls in baseball, and it’s about time. The opposition to the change, which will largely eliminate the phenomenon of games, championships and careers being adversely effected by “human error,” has been based on a total ignorance of the ethical principle of integrity.
- Meanwhile, on the baseball field in the most absurd season ever, the Baltimore Orioles are fighting for a play-off spot. The Baltimore Orioles stink, and they are only contenders because MLB has stooped to a hockey-style play-off system to artificially goose interest in the 60 game season. Fully half the teams will have a shot at being “World Champions.” Not among the eligible will be the 2019 World Champions, the Washington Nationals, and the 2018 World Champions, the Boston Red Sox, who have been even worse than the Orioles.
3. And yet Brian Stelter insists that CNN is an ethical news network…The New York Post reported that Fox News’ gadfly Tucker Carlson played a tape revealing that CNN President Jeff Zucker offered quid pro quo deal to then-candidate Donald Trump in 2016 through histhen fixer/lawyer/scumbag Michael Cohen. Zucker tells Cohen that he wants Trump to host a weekly show, and points out the importance of having CNN on Trump’s side in the presidential election. “You guys have had great instincts, great guts, and great understanding of everything. But you’re missing the boat on how it works going forward,” Zucker told Cohen during a March 2016 conversation Carlson revealed. “You cannot be elected president of the United States without CNN.” Zucker then explained why he would deal with the candidate only through Cohen. “I’m very conscious of not putting too much in email, as you’re a lawyer, as you understand,” Zucker said. “And, you know, as fond as I am of the boss, he also has a tendency, like, you know, if I call him or I email him, he then is capable of going out at his next rally and saying that we just talked and I can’t have that, if you know what I’m saying.”
Oddly, Stelter has not addressed this tape in any of his media commentary.
4. I would make this an Unethical Quote Of The Month, but it’s too stupid to be an unethical quote. “Mother Earth is angry, she’s telling us, whether she’s telling us with hurricanes on the Gulf Coast, fires in the West, whatever it is, that the climate crisis is real and has an impact,” quoth Nancy Pelosi.
Would someone please explain to Nancy that you can’t constantly blather on about “science” and continue to say things like “Mother Earth is angry”?
5. With this George Floyd note, I’m officially adding the Samuel L. Jackson clip (from “Jurassic Park”) to the Ethics Alarms Move Clip Pantheon:
It is increasingly likely that the officer who knelt on George Floyd’s neck will not be convicted of murder.
It has been revealed that in May of 2019, Floyd was stopped by police for selling drugs, swallowed the drugs, and then had to be hospitalized for an overdose:
The medical examiner has already found that Floyd probably died from the effects of an overdose of fentanyl, and not the pressure applied to his neck.
Let me know if you see any of this reported in the mainstream media.
53 thoughts on “Sunday Ethics Reflections, 9/13/2020: “Hold On To Your Butts!””
Who would excuse the shooters if they are minorities?
This is Compton. As far as I know, it hasn’t been gentrified yet.
1: I watched the video and while ‘protesters’ is technically correct, I saw five people walking around and shouting while a cop stands in the hospital driveway pointing what looks like a shotgun at them. There might have been a sixth person in the distance, or just a rando messing with a cell phone.
And while today is not the day to do it, we should probably have a conversation about the extremely poor relations between police and the community in Compton
Right on. Those cops sitting in a patrol vehicle were terrorizing the Compton populace. They had it coming.
Whether they had it coming or not would be pure conjecture on my part. Lacking any evidence to say they personally did, I’m going to err toward not. Reflexing trying to justify attempted murder is the domain of copsuckers. I’ll just wait and see.
We should still have a conversation about what’s been going on in Compton though.
“Let’s have a conversation” means the left gets to berate anyone who doesn’t agree with them. I’ll take a pass. I believe this event and that video may turn the election strongly in Trump’s favor. A picture is worth a thousand words. Trump’s tweet is an angry tweet and I think it aligns with a great deal of growing anger in the populace.
What’s a “copsucker?”
“Whether they had it coming or not would be pure conjecture on my part. Lacking any evidence to say they personally did, I’m going to err toward not.”
No, you can literally say “two cops ambushed while sitting in a patrol car did not have it coming”.
That you posed it as a possibility to consider should concern you about how far your own personal Overton Window has shifted in a frankly terrifying direction.
We should, in that conversation, talk about what minorities are doing to other minorities in Compton too. The cops probably would come out a lot less if people in the community didn’t hurt each other. A black friend of mine there has bars on her windows and it’s not because she’s scared of “copsuckers.”
Mrs. Q, I’m not sure, but I think “copsuckers” are people who do not hate police?
Any “conversation” will include no such thing.
I was thinking about how Jack had speculated police would be less likely to engage in active policing if they continued to be pilloried for taking any action against suspects. I suppose the fear was they’d just sit in their vehicles. What’s this going to do? Police are going to shelter in place in their precinct headquarters?
Sorry Jack, when I first heard they were blocking the access to the emergency room I said these people are fuckin animals and need to be shot. When I calmed down I said I want them to be charged with conspiracy to attempted first degree murder. There is no way that protesters,can arrive at the hospital before the ambulance without being complicit in the attempted killing. They were informed if the attack and took steps to ensure the cops died.
This is a nothing less than a coordnated attack. Biden an Harris have these officers blood on their hands and anyone that blames Trump for calling a spade a spade, or in this case rabid animals, is woefully misguided and must support the protesters who wanted to prevent medical care so the cops WOULD DIE! I don’t wantvto hear anymore crap about empathy from demented Joe and his totalitarian running mate.
This goes far beyond protesting.
I can only imagine an attack ad. “Trump called those who shot two sheriff’s deputies sitting in their car animals.”
Maybe PETA will criticize the President for being anti-animal.
Did you make an attempt to verify that claim?
Assumes facts not in evidence.
Conjecture without anything resembling proof.
I see one person speaking against violence. I see another stoking and trying to justify it…
Go gargle a bushel of dicks.
Who, exactly, is stoking and trying to justify violence, and how?
Reading the fucking Trump tweet that Jack linked in his summary.
Calling the shooter(s) animals is supposed to stoke and justify violence how?
Wow. Gargle a bushel of dicks? Does that mean Chris Marschner’s comment is objectionable because he’s not heterosexual?
“Violence of any kind is wrong; those who commit it should be caught and punished.” Hah! Say it ain’t so, Joe!
Are you kidding me? Isn’t it a little late to say that?
And is Jill your running mate? What about Kamala?
Your response is out line. Chris has a long history if high level, thorough, and thoughtful posts. He has never been flippant or condescending. You owe him an apology.
I’m with you, Chris.
When I heard this story I had the same thoughts. The shootingscwere more than attempted murder. These were attacks on the US system in its entirety, an attack against law and order, citizens who want security to pursue their own happiness. Blocking ambulances from entering a hospital emergency entrance strikes directly at peace and security. Those who do that are not “protestors” it “activists.” They are anarchists and must be net with force. Is Trump understands anything, he has a full grasp on the culture’s pulse.
You’re not President of the United States of America.
Jack, I think in many people’s minds, that “presidential” thing left the station when “that woman” was gargling a bushel full of dicks in the oval office.
That would be odd, since the two Presidents following Bill pretty much upheld the decorum and dignity of the office.
But the precedent had been set. I think Trump appealed, and continues to appeal, to a lot of voters who are sick and tired of faux decorum when Nancy Pelosi gets to say she’s “praying for the President” and tear up a SOTU speech with impunity. Would it were not so, but I think the “that’s not Presidential” accusation has been neutered.
Jack, I will agree with Bush but not with Obama unless you consider only his rhetorical skills. Being able to schmooze and appearing magnanimous is easy when you are not continually under attack. To me Obama was the Eddie Haskell of Presidents.
The security video of the thug executing the two police officers reminded me of one of Obama’s presidential norm obliterating capers: “If I had a son, he’d look like Tavon Martin.”
I concur, in one clear disqualifying aspect:
Obama is the first president that I am aware of that openly spoke antithetically about half of the populace. Bush is the last President who spoke of “we Americans”, Obama opened the era of “right-think Americans” versus “need to shrivel up and die because they are on the wrong side of history Americans”.
Jack wrote: “You’re not President of the United States of America.“
If I understood correctly what you are saying is that the President of the US should not refer to any people within the country as *animals*. I am not sure if he was referring strictly to the man who shot to officers, or to those *protesting* at the hospital, but in this sense it does not matter.
The most (I guess) ‘responsible’ thing, at least in a way, is for the President (any president) to avoid the use of such a hot term. The implication is of course that Blacks are ‘animals’ or ‘animal-like’ or incline to behavior that is more animalistic. This is an interesting topic in and of itself given that Blacks (often) self-identify more through the physical side of their being than through, shall I say, the intellectual side. All the forms of representation — sports, music to name the obvious — depend in this sense on an accentuation of physical characteristics and power.
Even the cultural tendency of Blacks to set out on rampages and immensely destructive rioting is, ipso facto, a more physical, unstudied, unmeditated and thus more *animalistic* use of power. It is not commensurate with *civil society* yet it is what they do. It is the way they act and the way they impose their will.
That is of course how the term ‘animalistic’ and also ‘bestial’ and ‘brutish’ are used. So, on one side (if I can speak generally for a *they*) they want to be seen as and exploit the possibilities of a more animalistic and even primitive sort of self-identification, but do not wish to be seen as animalistic in the concomitant and corresponding sense. Yet *their* behavior is often precisely that.
Be all of that as it may, nevertheless this *battle* taking shape has to do with the fact that people are getting tired I guess one might say with those descriptions of people or groups that have been established by *politically correct thinking*. The whole idea that ‘diversity is our strength’ is the perfect example of linguistic manipulation and social propaganda. Or that we are *equal* and will or can create the same sorts of things.
President Trump is an impulsive *bellwether* of a developing mood among white-European Americans certainly but also, to a somewhat lesser extent, among some factions of Blacks themselves — like the admirable Candice Owens. She points out that it is always the worst examples of Black Americans who are presented and defended — by Blacks themselves. That is to say, by those very *animals* like Michael Brown and George Floyd. She rebels against those types being representative of the type she wishes to be. It sound not exactly *politically correct* but if most Blacks acted like Candice Owens, and also if they could pronounce English like her, it would be far more easier to deal with Black culture generally.
So, I would suggest that what is taking place now, and what needs to take place even more, is a far more open battle against *Negro animality*. Not what *we* have created for them but what *they* have created for themselves. They make the bed they lie in.
They must be seen not for what we make them into with sophisticated propaganda-rhetoric — all this false-language of ‘inclusion’ and of course ‘equality’ — but for what *they* really are and for what they, left to themselves and unaided, would actually create. What they create is of course in evidence in places like Compton and in other ghetto-cities. Why is this? I do not know and I do not care to know. I am concerned about my people — those I define as mine and those I respect and relate to.
Are these facts or are these lies? Am I telling the truth or am I presenting a very mean and destructive lie? As Valygrrl so nicely puts it this is the *conversation* that needs to occur. But would I — would anyone? — be allowed to speak the truth? To put the true facts out on the table? Of course not. All the terms of that conversation are patrolled and controlled.
The entire *story* and the ridiculous fabricated narrative about African Americans in America is circumscribed by lies, mistruths, falseness, idealism and of course all the treacherous ridiculousness of the white Liberal — that classic enabler, that classic liar. We need only turn to what that enabler has done over the last century and a half to understand — because it is now rampaging in front of us — why these lies were destructive. Lies always unravel. And they are unraveling now.
In my thinking and writing I endeavor just o *get the facts out on the table for discussion*. I don’t care how people describe me.
I don’t say he should or shouldn’t. I am saying that the standard for what an ordinary citizen can amd should say in public and what a national leader says are not the same.
I kind of liked “Animals must be hit hard.” I guess I could say it “resonated.”
From the video, it appears as if it was a pre-teen but the security camera has a fish-eye lens that the police say may have distorted the actual height of the shooter.
Yes, distorted. Look at the police car. It looks like it has been “chopped” (to use 1950s hot-rodder lingo) with a roof drop of easily 6 inches. The lens probably did the same thing to the shooter.
2. Computer line calls. I think it should be noted that the fourteen errors were evidently the result mistakes made by the humans running the system, not the system itself. For example, they misread the results or failed to deploy the system. Funny.
Also funny that the main thrust of the NYT article seems to be that if there hadn’t been a human judge on the two main courts, Djokovic would still be in the tournament and all would be right in the world. Hah!
I don’t generally respond to those that end their point with go gargle with a bag of dicks or some such thing. I will not respond to filth with filth. Such comments speak to the character of the person that feels it necessary to bolster her opinion.
I also do not troll people on any site. Obviously, someone else failed to understand what I was actually responding to ” Incredible: flat learning curve. After all the uproar about calling people “animals.” And if the shooters are minorities…The only one who can lose this election for President Trump is President Trump.”
My point was that the average person with any intellect would consider people who block the entrance to a hospital so that two officers, who were targeted for assassination, would have treatment delayed and have a greater likelihood of dying were in fact animals. Although, I do believe non-human animals themselves would be offended by Trump’s tweet but I don’t think they vote. Actually, maybe they will this year. It was reported that they were shouting “We hope you die”. Actually, based on the behavior of so many humans now I would rather be called an animal – they don’t find ways to hate they only act out of fear.
Now I am not some high school science denying dropout that waves a Confederate Battle Flag on my pick up truck that I drive to the Westboro Baptist Church. I have an MBA with a concentration in Economics and have been a college instructor and business consultant. I spent a great deal of time working in West Baltimore trying my level best to improve the economy of the neighborhoods west of UMD Shock Trauma to Caton Avenue. Basically, I worked to improve the economic conditions among African Americans in what was originally Parren J Mitchell’s district which became Elijah Cummings district.
I will offer a few other points:
My initial reaction occurred in my car while listening to the news on the radio so I had to take the report from the provider as true. I was unable to verify the veracity of the claim as I had no other means to do so as I was driving. Nonetheless, I think my initial reaction would be fairly common among many people from all walks of life. Sure, the media might try to spin the tweet but I think their efforts will all on deaf ears. You just cannot make Trump look like the bad guy here. How often is it that verification is a one sided requirement for some?
After my initial reaction I thought about what could be done about it. The problem is that the anarchist’s tactics are similar to ISIS cells in which there is not clear command and control structure but people know when to act by taking cues from others.
I said there was no way that without having been advised of the shooting they would not have been able to assemble at the hospital before the ambulance arrived. The response was “facts not in evidence” . Curiously, I never hear those words coming from that direction when it is stated that Officer Chauvin murdered George Floyd. To most of America it looked like that is what happened. We are now learning more every day.
The fact is that the cry that Police are hunting blacks to kill them is based 100% on conjecture without a factual basis. In fact, every damn disproportionate impact finding is circumstantial and thus not evidence if circumstance is no basis for evidence. If that is the standard then no one can be prosecuted without direct evidence and convictions based on circumstantial evidence are without merit. I submit that their arrival at the hospital emergency entrance in time to interfere with the delivery of the officers had to be the result of prior knowledge of the shooting. Otherwise they would have no reason to have gone there to interfere or protest.
Correct me if I am wrong. First: If I only drive the getaway car after a robbery in which 3 persons are shot to death I can be charged with the robbery as well as the murders. I am complicit whether or not I pull the trigger. Second: In some other case I can be charged with premeditation even if that premeditation is a few seconds before the act. Third, conspiracy to effect a crime does not require advance formal planning. Acts by another party who learn of the original crime and subsequently participates in a manner such that through those acts they effectively achieve the desired results of the original perpetrator would be complicit in the crime.
As an aside, I seem to recall that we just spent over 30 million dollars on trying to convict a president with highly suspect circumstantial evidence and double hearsay. And, we just learned that 15 members of the Mueller team forgot their cell phone passwords – after being told to turn them over to the IG – and then proceeded to to enter in wrong passwords so that their Apple phones would automatically wipe the drive. Seems suspect to me given these people are all freakin’ lawyers who know how Iphone security works. Hell, I know they know because they tried to compel Apple to unlock the San Bernadino terrorist’s phones some years ago. Don’t give me that they all had the same accidental problem.
As I said earlier, flash mobs or other instant protests are no longer coordinated in what we typically call coordination with a structured command and control. We are seeing cells of people that turn out on a moments notice to interfere with law enforcement, riot and loot. A tweet, an Instagram post or snapchat is enough to call in the antagonists. How it is coordinated is immaterial but any communication between multiple people that results in a specific activity is by definition coordination.
When I say Biden and Harris have blood on their hands it is Blood Libel but when CNN, MSNBC, Biden, Harris and the entire DNC say Trump has blood on his hands for not wanting to cause a panic over Covid even after Fauci denies Trump misrepresented anything we have stone cold silence if not tacit agreement from some persons. Bull shit. By the way, Neither Biden nor Harris are Jewish so Blood Libel would be incorrect usage.
Biden’s sudden epiphany in favor of law enforcement is 106 days long overdue and many believe the change is a result of polling data that show that the riots, violence and looting taking place across the country is hurting his poll numbers. Up until Don Lemmon’s pronouncement he needs to say something all he did was lay the blame at Trump’s feet. Until recently he openly praised what was transpiring in Seattle and Portland as did his running mate.
I stand by my statement that anyone that supports those yelling “I hope they die” irrespective of whether or not they are police officers, your grandmother, or even a political adversary and wants to blame the president for using the word animal to describe such people is woefully misguided.
I want Biden to answer one question; Now that he and his running mate have all but called 60 plus million Trump supporters uneducated racist white supremacists how will he plan to unite us if we are so damn deplorable? Evidence you want – he and Harris support keeping Critical Race Theory and anti racism training funded. As you know, the first precept of CRT is that all whites are racist. Why is he not going on TV and telling everyone he is a racist because he is white if federal workers must endure that training?
I would be interested to know how Biden and Harris would respond if those 60 million decided to resist his administration and began sit down strikes, accosting democrats in elevators, blocking highways, or tying up the business districts or pillaging them. Because it is highly unlikely that Trump supporters would engage in such tactics this is merely an academic question . Nonetheless, it is a question that should be presented to the Biden Harris team.
Hell, the Westboro Baptist Church does not engage in those kind of tactics.
I can still recall what I now call the Mark O. Hatfield Courthouse Ethics Train Wreck, which was the Democrats’ and the media (but I repeat myself) biggest gaslighting campaign in my life.
Read this article from David Marcus.
It did surprise me that Jack did not writer a single blog post about this gaslighting campaign, this ethics train wreck.
I have not seen evidence that protesters arrived at the hospital before the cops who were shot. One report said the protesters arrived and were met by “heavy police presence”. Other reports say the protesters were at the hospital where the two officers were being treated, implying the officers were in the hospital before the protesters arrived.
Regardless, it is presumptive to say the protesters were accomplices to attempted murder. Given the existence of police scanners in the hands of news media and other civilians (as well as cell phones), word can get out almost instantly, and protesters can respond very quickly.
As always there will be more to this story, and we may learn that there was coordination, but at this point, we just do not know that.
Trump’s tweet definitely is provocative, and while it appears he was tweeting about the suspect who shot the cops, not the protesters, he as usual was imprecise and crass, saying “animals” instead of a more proper, singular term. I’m sure that will resonate well with a lot of his supporters, just as I am sure it will be used against him.
So man is not an animal but instead a special creation? Darwin canceled!
AJ I almost stated that humans are by classification animals as we are not vegetables or minerals. So what is the beef with him using the word animal. Humans has a narcissism gene that makes us think that because we have the capacity to kill all other life we are superior.
#4 – Pelosi has two entries for the stupidest comment. When asked about the middle east peace deal, she said it is just Trump trying to distract from Covid-19.
#5 – There is more than that in Fridays developments.
The judge did rule that one if the prior police incidents was inadmissible and the one you cite is under consideration. I don’t see how it can be excluded.
The judge also disqualified three members of the prosecution for the conduct in a meeting with the corner.
Also, the judge ruled that each jurror will be questioned in the witness box with no other jurrors present. This part should be interesting. I’m betting there will be a question along the lines “do you already think Chauvin is guilty?”
The MSM news report I reacted to said protesters were blocking the entrance for the ambulance transporting to officers. That was my evidence initially and I would change my opinion if it turns out it was incorrect.
I ask you why would who believes that protesting at a hospital where the injured were taken is designed to effect change. It is a provocative attempt to goad police into overreacting. This is the modus operandi of Antifa. It serves to turn the good guys into bad guys for political advantage by leveraging human emotion of the officers. If it’s possible to lawfully connect these people to helping to facilitate criminal activity then it should done instead of avoidance to placate them.
I pointed out that coordination is no longer an ordinary command and control organizization but has become organized as asymetric warfare. Read Sun Tsu. He speaks of using the opponents physical strength to exploit their emotional weakness.
Whether these groups use police scanners or cell phones the coordination exists even without specific direct orders. One only needs to say “when you hear of an opportunity that will showcase police acts rise up an act for social justice.” Sympathizers will respond because another guy spent 8 years conditioning them. I am not willing to give his understudy the same opportunity.
I have lived my life giving all the benefit of the doubt; but, no longer. I am a firm believer in constitutional protections and I see them being eroded away by the very people that cry out for them. Trump may be crass, boorish and imprecise but I will accept that as temporary tradeoff in the battle against mob rule.
The Italian corporatists of the 30s aligned with Il Duce’ andvhis fascist regime just as they are today. They want big government for sales and greater regulation to supress new entrants. Trump threatens their power so the unholy alliance between corporatists and socialist/facists has arisen to take him down a common enemy.
Day by day I become a bit less sympathetic to those who live in a grievance culture and blame others for their own lack of achievement. My lack of sympathy does not make me a white supremacist or racist, it makes me a realist.
Chris, your initial visceral reaction is understandable, especially given a report that the protesters were trying to block access for the ambulance bringing the cops in.
It is more and more obvious that there are plenty of would-be protesters/activists just waiting for some event that they can turn into a newsworthy incident. That’s what I think happened at the hospital.
And, I absolutely agree that the protesters were trying to provoke a response from the cops that would escalate the situation. The cops showed admirable restraint. If they actually were blocking an ambulance from arriving at the ER, they would have to be removed by force, whatever level of force it took. It appears that wasn’t necessary. The arrest of one protester who tried to enter the hospital and of a news reporter who interfered were proper and seemed to be handled professionally, although the arrest of that reporter now will fuel even more anti-police sentiment.
To a layman like myself, it seems that the protesters could be charged with inciting a riot, and I would find it very satisfying for them to be locked up. But, doing so would inch us a bit closer to a police state, and I doubt they would be convicted.
That might be how you look at it, but I brought receipts.
Watch the videos, compare that with the claims made by cops.
With regard to the receipts, photos and videos only tell a part of any story, the part that is in front of the camera. If they were protesting the attempted murder of two police officers, your view would make more sense. But, that’s not what they were protesting.
Anyone can claim to be a reporter, and a lanyard tag is easy to fake. She approached closer to the cops than she should have or needed to, as evidenced by how quickly they were on her after saying “back up”. Her claim that there was no place to back up to is not credible, since by her statement and the video, she was walking toward the arrest.
The cops were on edge after the attempted murders, and they reacted legitimately to what they perceived as a threat. The apparent dishonest statements about her arrest may have been lying or may have been the result of confusion and conflicting statements.
Valky, I’m afraid you have lost me here. I have only a general understanding of the Overton Window, but, I’m not running for office or trying to fit policies into a narrow and shifting window. I’m trying to understand what happened after those two cops were shot.
I think I entertained a few possibilities, so I’m not clear which of those you’re talking about.
One, the protesters, or one or more of them, wanted to get into the hospital and finish the assassinations. One person was arrested, apparently trying to get in.
Two, the reporter may have been perceived as a threat by the cops. Seems reasonable to me, given that two cops had been shot, the (small) crowd was anti-police, and she, apparently, was not known to the police at the scene.
Three, the county sheriff may have lied or may have spoken based on confusing or incomplete information.
So, please help me understand your comment, whether it was related to one of these possibilities, or to something else, and why that is so terrifying.
In addition, with regard to a discussion about Compton, I’m willing to do some homework if there is the possibility for a productive discussion. My knowledge of Compton so far is that it is somewhere near LA, so I’d have some work to do.
Right, I should have gotten back to you yesterday. I selfishly decided to take an ibuprofen and watch a rerun of Time Team instead. My bad.
What I did was paste part of your reply to me to Michael West and part of his to you. See in a reflexive defense of cops he’s angry that I couldn’t say they didn’t deserve to be shot but only probably didn’t deserve to be shot so I used your comment about not knowing what happened when there was no video. While using his comments about what was right on video as a reply to you…
You see where I’m going with this.
You haven’t been an asshole though and didn’t deserve that. I apologize.
It would be faster for you to google up an explanation of the Overton window than for me to try to paraphrase it. It has to do with the changing face of what is and isn’t in the mainstream of public discourse.
What happened after the cops were shot? The only things we know are on the videos. The sheriff’s department have proven themselves willing to lie even in the face of video evidence. Any claims they made that aren’t backed up cannot be taken at face value.
No need for an apology. If I had read all the comments more thoroughly, I would have gotten your point. A number of posters here openly discuss arming themselves to defend against the threats they perceive may come when the cops no longer provide protection. That may be a part of what is going on in Compton, except that the cops are the threat. If Deputy Gangs are as prevalent and as brutal as some of the articles portray, or if they are even believed to be, a violent response is understandable. There is a concept in the military of “active defense” in which you don’t just sit and wait for the enemy to attack.
Spent a bit of time this morning updating myself about the LA County Sheriff’s Department and the Compton Station, and that does change my perspective. The attempted assassination of those two officers is absolutely wrong, despite what seems to be going on there in the form of ‘deputy gangs’. But, what I now know about Compton and didn’t know before is helpful in trying to understand the motivation of the shooter and the protesters.
Yeah, assassinations are generally wrong quite aside from being illegal.
And yeah, stuff has been going on there for some time and it didnt’ take the current national protests to make people there angry enough that this could happen. Especially when all it takes is one person with a gun.
We’ll learn more about it later… Maybe?
I agree with your perspectives. I do believe that we are seeing a convergence of insurrectionists and people that truly believe in equal justice. The latter are being exploited and used as shields or distractors. The insurrectionist goal is to create the illusion that government and their agents are racist fascists who are out to hurt people. When stories about a child taken to a protest and gets pepper sprayed because the parents put the child in harms way taken precedence over information regarding injuries incurred by police the insurrectionists win in the battle of public opinion among those who want desperately to believe that with progressive policies and massive redistribution of income we will solve all the problems of the world. Their naivete’ blinds them to the fact that enforcement of love an harmony requires a police state
Valkygrrl wrote: “We should still have a conversation about what’s been going on in Compton though.”
If there are or if there will be *conversations* it is interesting to meditate on the fact that different factions in America right now are definitely having such ‘conversations’. This of course reflects the fact that there are different and various americas. So, it then becomes necessary to say and to acknowledge that there is not now much, or any, agreement when each faction or pole offers its interpretation of what is going on, be it *in Compton* or in the country. But, and this is another aspect of this, the larger conversation does not have only to do with either Compton or America, but extends to Europe and includes Canada and the former English colonies.
So, the largest conversation has to do with The Occident and then with Occidental Civilization. As an observer and as a researcher — I define myself that way and not as an activist (though I have some activist’s concerns and I suppose some activists — I try to tune-in and pay attention to the *interpretations* that people offer as they gaze out on the Present. Very different views emerge. Some correspond and some agree, at least in a larger general sense, yet others to not in hardly any sense correspond or agree. In fact they are diametrically opposed and they cancel each other out. This is not hard to illustrate. Compare the ‘general program’ presented by BLM with the general program described by Michael Voris and the Catholic traditionalists of Church Militant. You could pull out many different tendentious examples of conflict and dis-accord. Philosophically and sociologically it is a fascinating issue and problem.
Since one of my original questions — from years back, when much of this was just beginning to take shape — had to do, and still has to do, with trying to determine who and what stands behind the events of the day, my starting-point in this sense was and still is semi-conspiratorial. What I mean by this is that what we are seeing today is an extension of numerous other things. And I operate with the assumption that powerful interests — always — attempt to influence, control and direct events to their advantage. In my view, as anyone who has read what I write knows, I see the events of 9/11 as being ‘classic examples’ of using huge events, dramatic events, to then go forward with rather vast projects that are directed, to the degree that they can be directed, by extra-governmental and para-governmental power-centers.
It seems to me, therefore, fair to notice and fair and reasonable to point to the importance of looking to *the larger picture*. Compton is definitely a place, one could turn one’s attention to it and one could learn and reveal many different things about it, but in a sense that is important and relevant this will not key you in — as in *provide a passcode* — to a better understanding of what is going on in the larger scale. But can the larger scale, the more encompassing view, provide illustration about what is going on within the limited circumstance? I think it can.
Again, different people with different interests will put together and organize different *narratives* as they assemble their ‘interpretive description’ about what is going on. And I have made mine clear.
In the larger picture what is going on in America, and what has gone on in America in the aftermath of the Second WW, has been a large *restructuring* of America. I use the term ‘dispossession’ and also ‘displacement’ and, of course, these are unconventional and also (as I say) ‘illegal’ ways of describing the facts of reality. And what I mean by this is something very definite and very precise: the deliberate undermining of the European-American *owner* of America. It is very simple: in 1965 white European-Americans were 90% of the population and were the *supermajority*. Today they stand somewhere between 60-65% and are in decline. One has to look to different structures of ideology, and also to certain power-grouping on a world level, to be able to understand what I might describe as a ‘larger plan’ for world reorganization. That is, to create a so-called ‘globalized’ and ‘interconnected’ world that serves the interests of extremely large and extremely powerful *interests* that are international. This does not originate, necessarily, outside of America and there are definitely powerful interests within America that are just as complicit in desiring to create and construct such a *world* as I allude to here.
So in order to understand what *really is going on*, one really has no choice but to begin to turn one’s gaze to the larger, molding powers, and to the larger structural events. It is not the ‘isolated, specific event’ that can shed light on the larger picture, but rather the larger picture when it is seen and understood that provides interpretive structure to be able to better see the specific and isolated event.
Valkygrrl wrote: “Watch the videos, compare that with the claims made by cops.”
Well this is interesting too. You have to ask yourself “What do cops *see* today?” Note the special inflection on the word *see*. They see factions within the very structure of the country — government, business, academia — turning against them and seeking to vilify and also undermine them. I have not looked much into it but I have heard that police are quitting. There must be a great deal of undermining of confidence and many conversations between police officers as to what is going on and why.
The videos that you linked to — to my eyes — do not undermine the view that the police have. An assassination-attempt on two officers took place in a ‘cold-blooded killing’ manner. That officers had to make themselves PRESENT at the hospital against *protesters* who express their Extreme antagonism in any way, is really quite enough to bolster the perception that those police officers, and a large segment of the police throughout the nation, about what is going on there. Those people hate the police. Those people are part of militant, activist, and also criminal groupings. They are moved by the type of animus one finds in the most violent rap music. That sentiment is now linking-up with violent, riotous and in some senses revolutionary rhetoric and activism that is being exploited by very real power-factions within the structures of America (and also global powers).
This all has to be seen and then talked about. But you do not do that. You don’t do anything really!
Now, you seem sympathetic. Which I will take to mean that you are of the opinion that there is systemic abuse of police power and you are likely, to one degree or another, on the side (in one way or another) of the activism of Black Lives Matter and the present assault on established power.
But can you actually defend your views? In a structured, rational and soundly argued way? This does not appear so in your case and it never has appeared so. You do not present ideas of any sort, ever. You do not outline a position, ever. You only seem to *emote* from time to time without articulation.
See if you actually came out, in some substantial way, with some sort of holistic and ordered narrative you would then be encouraging and participating in the *conversation* you say you want.